Well said. In the long run it's easier for your baby and you when you teach them to fall asleep on their own, or let them learn how to entertain themselves with their toys, rather than picking them up every time they cry.

That's simply NOT true. Babies are not capable of learning when "something is really wrong". Crying is their ONLY way to express a wide range of valid emotions. What they learn is the futility of asking for help or comfort. Parenting FAIL

Babies are capable of learning quite a bit more than previously thought. Studies show that they can differentiate between quantities of objects, show some understanding of a seemingly impossible scenarios, and if you go on YouTube and search up crying baby Americas funniest home videos, there is a baby that crawls around until it's in its parents view and cries, and repeats as necessary whenever they move to a different room.

Agreed 100%. What a selfish prat. The crying is louder inside the flat and I doubt the mum enjoyed it any more than you did. FYI screaming through a wall rarely quiets a baby. BTW, didn't know it was a boy, DocBastard. Congrats to you, the wife, and the new big sister. Good times ahead!

I can be PERFECTLY empathetic but I might get a LITTLE emotional if I'm being kept up by annoying endless crying! Hell I can do both at the same time. I've got a feeling this mom was just killing op with kindness anyway passive aggressive >.>

I think the main difference is that the parents DECIDED to have a baby who would cry all the time.

Of course the parents have to deal with it because they're the ones the wanted/made the kid, but why should everyone else have to be kept up at night when they had nothing to do with making the baby? That's not fair. Either do something to make the baby stop crying, soundproof your walls, or take the baby somewhere else so that no one else has to deal with something that is technically your fault (I mean, you can't exactly blame the baby....) This is one of the reasons that I want kids. My neighbors, unfortunately, have twins that cry constantly and are terrible parents who do nothing about it or play loud music to drown it out. :( How is that fair to everyone else?

It's their apartment too, they have a right to raise a family there and can't help the thickness of the walls. @Leadman, if you get loudly verbally "emotional" in the middle of the night because you got disturbed from your sleep, how are you any different than the crying baby?

saksxalmo - Everyone else has to deal with it because that's how apartments work. No one moves into an apartment building thinking they live there alone and will be in quiet, peaceful solitude.

If it's gotten to the point where OP yelled out what he/she did, it (the baby's crying in the middle of the night) had probably been a chronic thing. IMO, the mother of the baby should be more attentive to her baby's needs and not chronically let the baby wail through the walls at 2am, which leads to a neighbour (in this case, the OP) yelling out in frustration. Although, I have to accredit the mother for apologizing about it to the OP, and hopefully she'll be able to ensure the crying at night is dealt with in the future. Don't get me wrong, babies are totally allowed to cry whenever they want, but the parents of that baby also carry the responsibility of dealing with the nuissance to others of having an irritating noise around what is supposed to be their serene environnment (in this case, the OP's bedroom).

Doc, in that case, the OP was completely right in cursing out the neighbors' baby and YOU have no right to complain either.

Oh, and like I said somewhere below, not wanting to hear a constantly screaming human in the middle of the night, when most people like to sleep, especially if they have to wake up early, is not the same as wanting complete solitude. Just like not wanting tinnitus is not the same as wanting to be deaf.

Grr, my comment didn't post, then it randomly appeared. Please disregard this comment. :)

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that most of the people who are bitching that the parents are culpable for not attending to their babies needs don't have children or aren't old enough to have ******* clue about anything, let alone how to care for an infant. There is no magic switch to get an infant to stop crying. Many times you try everything you can think of to get them to stop and nothing works. Reflux is a somewhat common issue with infants that will cause uncontrollable crying. Medicine doesn't always work, either. Think about how distressing this is for the parents.

102--The parents chose to have the baby, so they should have to deal with it. Like I said, if the infant won't stop crying, they should either soundproof their apartment or take it outside until it stops crying.

Its not a parents fault for having a child. No one deserves it. It's life. Obviously you don't have children and don't understand the way life works. People have children and they have the right to have children. The apartment is hers too. She shouldn't have to go. The baby needs to sleep somewhere safe. Because it is a helpless baby!!! If the op has a problem then the op can go. Not the mom. It's hard enough to get a baby asleep in the house no less elsewhere

Bastard Junior #2 is going to be an awesome kid.

It IS the parents' fault because they made the baby. If they don't want to deal with the noise, they could have used contraception. The neighbor doesn't deserve having to listen to the baby's screaming because there's nothing s/he could have done to prevent them having a baby. They have the right to have a baby, but they shouldn't take away other people's rights to sleep. Again, the parents can soundproof the apartment. They could take the baby outside or go somewhere else to deal with it because it's their responsibility, not the neighbors'. The baby will not be "unsafe" just because you take it somewhere else for it to fall asleep. Likewise, I take my dog outside if he's making to much noise because I don't want to disturb my neighbors. Why should you be able to keep a screaming baby but I shouldn't be able to keep a barking dog? Is it okay for me to play obscenely loud music at 2 am as well? Also, a baby is significantly louder than, say, neighbors' footsteps or neighbors' voices, so requesting that the baby be quiet is not requesting absolute silence, it's just requesting a little less constant wailing.

It's sad that you think "obviously you don't have children" makes me unable to comment on how unfair this situation is. I could just as easily say "obviously you HAVE children." No, I don't have children and don't have interest in having children because they scream, poop, can't communicate, etc. So if I've chosen to never have kids to avoid all this, why should I have to deal with someone else's kid? It makes no sense. Have kids if you want, but you don't have to keep others from sleeping because of your decision. Also, it may be her home, but the rules for living in an apartment are VERY different from living in a separate house. If I can't play loud music or let my dog make a lot of noise, then why should a parent be allowed to let an infant scream in the middle of the night?

Because obviously a child is something you can not control and nothing like a dog. You can't even come close to saying you can take a child out like a dog. That's just ******* stupid. No the op can leave if they have a problem. You are insensitive to the fact that the mother and father(if there is one) have to listen to the cries too. And you have no idea of the situation at hand. You can't say she choose. What if she was raped? Not everyone is heartless and does abortions and adoptions. If she ha a baby they come over other people if the op has a problem they can leave. Obviously you have no respect for life. Children are living too and need a little bit more time and care than others. They don't need to or should be forced out of their place because they cry they are not dogs. Therefore you don't take them outside because they are being loud. Also it's a wee bit obvious why you won't have kids. It's because you can't take a challenge. Children are hard. Some people are too immature to do it. Some cant take a challenge. You claim it's the way they are. Having children is life. The way it works and you just can't handle it. If your parents took that attitude you wouldn't be here.

Also if you knew the rules, you would know that you can't "sound proof" the walls And people who choose to live there know that others will be loud. It's apart of living in an apartment.

"Because obviously a child is something you can not control and nothing like a dog. You can't even come close to saying you can take a child out like a dog. That's just ******* stupid." What's the difference in this case? You can't control a dog's barking any more than you can control a child's crying, unless 1) you're cruel and hit the dog, or 2) you've trained the dog, which takes time, and is basically the equivalent to the child growing up. If you've done everything you can to stop the dog from barking, then you have to take it outside, so why can't you do the same with a child? "No the op can [sic] leave if they have a problem. You are insensitive to the fact that the mother and father(if there is one) have to listen to the cries too. And you have no idea of the situation at hand. You can't say she choose. What if she was raped? Not everyone is heartless and does abortions and adoptions." First, YOU'RE being insensitive and getting off topic by saying that people who give their children up for adoption or have abortions are heartless. You shouldn't try to start that kind of debate when it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. So technically, she did have a choice, and she chose to keep the child-- she obviously wanted to take care of it and was willing to put up with endless screaming if she didn't put it up for adoption. Mothers that keep their babies are willing to put up with poop and mess and screaming, presumably for some kind of psychological reward (although I honestly don't understand what it is.) The neighbor gets no choice and simply has to put up with the screaming baby, and doesn't get the reward (love, I guess) in return. And again, why can't she just take the baby somewhere else? "If she ha a baby they come over other people" What are you trying to say here? "if the op has a problem they can leave." Why should the OP leave when it's the mother's fault? Again, the mother chose to have the baby, not the OP. "Obviously you have no respect for life. Children are living too and need a little bit more time and care than others. They don't need to or should be forced out of their place because they cry they are not dogs. Therefore you don't take them outside because they are being loud." A baby won't know the difference between a car or a store or a restaurant and a house. Therefore it probably doesn't care that you have to take it outside when it makes too much noise. It's not "heartless" to take the child outside when it's keeping others awake-- that way you stop bothering, say, four neighbors, at the expense of... NO ONE! The parents are already awake, and as I've stated, the baby it their responsibility. The baby will not know the difference, will not care, and will not be offended that the parents have taken it outside to fall asleep. So no one really loses in my scenario, but everyone except the baby loses in yours. "Also it's a wee bit obvious why you won't have kids. It's because you can't take a challenge. Children are hard. Some people are too immature to do it. Some cant take a challenge. You claim it's the way they are. Having children is life. The way it works and you just can't handle it. If your parents took that attitude you wouldn't be here." That's really stupid. Do you honestly think that the only people who don't want kids are afraid to live up to the challenge? Some people just don't want kids. I personally don't see the point in having children, I think they're gross, and I think they would interfere with my goals in life which, if you ask me, are just as if not more challenging than raising a child. It's really disappointing that you think that all there is to life is having kids. :( But it's "a wee bit" funny that you're acting like you know why I do things when you know nothing about me. I'm not saying that everyone should think like me-- if other people want to have kids, fine, that's their problem, so I'm not sure why you would say that about my parents... Have you ever been at the movies and heard a wailing child and thought "Man, that kid's parents should really take that kid out of here. I didn't pay $10 to sit through 2 hours of crying/He's ruining the movie for the people who paid for it." It's exactly the same here, but with apartments and sleeping. So, in summary: what's that thing they always say about religion? Oh, yes. Religion is like a penis. It's fine to have one and it's fine to be proud of it, but please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around... and PLEASE don't try to shove it down my throat. I have the same philosophy, but with children. ^_^

"Also if you knew the rules, you would know that you can't "sound proof" the walls" It depends on where you live. Someone else here said that they bought sound proofing stuff for their neighbors when they had a baby. And you can make rooms pretty sound proof with common household items. It's not like you have to tear down and rebuild the wall. "And people who choose to live there know that others will be loud. It's apart of living in an apartment." I know, I live in one. But there is a difference between occasionally having to hear arguments or dropping loud things, or loud music, movies, etc. (which are all over relatively quickly) and a loud, ceaseless, annoying (again, iirc babies' cries are evolutionarily supposed to get your attention) crying in the middle of the night.

Saksxalmo - I applaud and support your decision not to have children. Everyone should make up his/her own mind, and I'm impressed you've come to such a difficult decision so early in life. TAKE THE CHILD OUTSIDE?? Are you completely insane, trolling, or actually that stupid? Based on what you've said, you be a ******* awful mother. Grow the **** up. The world does not revolve around you.

It's not a religion and as they said your ******* fifteen. I may not be much older but I have a perspective on the world. This is just an opinion from a teenager who doesnt understand alot of things (not calling you stupid) involving the real world. A child is much smarter than your giving credit. They do know the difference of there room and outside. And yes they will disturb more neighbors if you take them outside. Now I understand your young. You think you know what you want. And me just saying this will piss you off. But I've been where your at. And please don't go on anymore. Because until your old enough or experience any of this you won't have any clue or care too. I was saying what you were too. Except years ago. And really, someday you might remember this and realize your wrong. I'm not being rude I'm just saying don't say something you'll regret. I told myself I'll never have kids. I had one. I had the same unknowing thoughts as you. Until I had my own. It's nothin like what you say. Maybe someday you will want children. But your 15 and you don't care to understand parenthood or what it involves. So just stop arguing until you do. Also this is a bad situation for both of them. I've said mean thing when I was tired and whatever. But I don't think calling them a demon spawn was Neccessary. This could have been settled many ways. And maybe the woman could have tried harder.

Also I didn't start this argument. Just to be clear. If you scroll up and read, it's you attacking the first replier.

No sorry not to specify I meant sak. Because she said for me not to shove my opinion down her throat. Like it was only me and I was just stating that I wasn't the first to say something

.....earplugs....

Kind of like your parents?

Take the child outside?! That's funny. Maybe you can give the kid a Scooby Snack if he/she doesn't cry. Hey Sak, why don't you go back to watching Spongebob and leave the important issues to the adults to discuss? You're obviously not ready to contribute in any meaningful way.

#152, dogs don't shut up like a mute button either, which is why I said that the parents should take the baby somewhere else. I never said anything about changing diapers or shoving a tit in its mouth; you're making that up yourself. The baby will be fine in a warm car and won't bother the neighbors-- it's a win-win. I can judge people based on their choices, and this person CHOSE to have a baby. What's so confusing about that? Also, I don't know anyone who has beauty sleep in the middle of the night-- most of the time that's actual needed sleep. You know, so that they can function properly. It's not as superficial as you're trying to make it seem. ALSO, the baby could have been born after the OP moved in, so research is worthless.

#195-- ad hominem. Try explaining why you can't sit with a baby in a car or in a restaurant, where people aren't sleeping, instead of using personal attacks. I obviously didn't mean dump the baby in the backyard. Try to be relevant to the actual argument next time! :)

162 and 165-- don't worry, I know how contraception works, so I'm probably not going to get pregnant by accident. If I do, I would abort it or give it up for adoption. I'm not going to have a baby on purpose because 1) health issues in my family I don't want to pass on 2) overpopulation 3) dealing with a screaming human who can't communicate 4) dealing with other people's poop is disgusting and 5) I have no interest in children, which is, for some reason, always the hardest idea for some people to understand... I personally don't understand why anyone would WANT a child, but at least I accept that some do, instead of insisting that they'll "change" as they get older. You can't just assume that I don't know anything or don't have a personality based on my age. I know for a fact that my opinion won't change unless my entire personality changes, and then I wouldn't really be "me" at all, would I? Saying that I'm inexperienced or stupid based on my age is also bias and an example of ad hominem anyway. :) A baby does not know the difference between two rooms. That's ridiculous. Show me a scientific study showing that they do, or just ask yourself-- do you remember your mother carrying you between rooms at 10 months old? Did it psychologically damage you? Of course not. Taking a baby somewhere else won't bother MORE neighbors because public places like restaurants won't have sleeping people in them and walls between indoors and outdoors are thicker than those between apartments.

157-- you mean people who, being outside, wouldn't be sleeping anyway? Or who, being in a public place, would already be hearing passing cars and other noises you typically hear in public? Just sit with the baby in a car or a store, it's not that complicated. And it wouldn't make the sleeping louder, that doesn't make sense. Just admit it, I'm right.

Doc-- again, obviously I don't mean toss the child in the backyard. I mean sit in a car, restaurant, or other *perfectly comfortable* place AWAY from sleeping people with it. That's not stupid. I expected someone like you to think a little about what I said and what the alternatives are. You people must think I've never seen a baby just because I care about the neighbors, too.... "you be" Did you mean I would be or I will be? Either way, I could be a perfectly good mother if I wanted to, but I have no interest in doing so.

~oops, phantom comment~ :)

Dear Saxsxalamo - #1we live in a society. if uncontrollable sounds of human life bother you, get earplugs. #2 dog barking can be controlled by supersonic devices that even the neighbors can buy. It doesn't hurt the dogs. #3 Please go outside & never reproduce. You're giving us a headache.

It was the parents choice to have an annoying child. Not his. That’s really not supposed to be his problem if the baby is crying. He needs sleep. If anything, the mother is selfish

ummmm if the walls were soundproof, she wouldn't be expressing anything as she wouldn't hear anything

I shouldn't *need* to wear earplugs in my own home just because someone else decided to have a kid. The people with the baby should be the ones providing options to aid the people around them. Like putting soundproofing in their apartment.

If the OP has a child, the baby's crying would be his/her responsibility. This is the neighbor's child, that the OP did not choose to have, so it's not fair that the OP has to put up with noise that isn't his/her fault.

And it's not fair that the other neighbours have to put up with the noises OP makes when he/she gets cranky.

odexy - I had a feeling you were a self-centered teenager before I clicked on your profile. The world doesn't revolve around you. If you want silence in your home, buy a cabin in the middle of the woods or an island in the middle of the ocean. That's the only way you'll get complete silence.

I'm so glad you took the time to look at my profile so you could discriminate me based solely on a comment and my age. Believe me, I know where this OP is coming from having lived in a building with a baby who would cry all night long. Ear plugs weren't enough to drown out the childs constant wails and I couldn't even report it to the landlord because it was THEIR child. I ended up needing to move, all because my neighbors couldn't be considerate enough to at least try to be reasonable. I honestly don't believe it's self centered at all to want a good nights sleep when I work in the AM. Especially when just a couple extra dollars spent on the parents part for soundproofing would be sufficient.

Odexy - then it's lesson learned for you. As I said, the only way to ensure complete silence is to remove yourself from society. When you live with neighbours, you near noises. When you live in an apartment with other apartments all around you, you hear MORE noises. It's unavoidable. Your situation with a constantly-screaming child is unfortunate, but you usually can't blame the parents for a screaming infant. Some infants are colicky and scream for hours at a time for no apparent reason, and NOTHING will stop it except waiting a few months. If it was hard for you, imagine how your neighbours felt.

Doc... 1. You can absolutely blame parents for having a screaming infant because they produced said infant. It's not like babies just randomly appear and you can't put them up for adoption or anything, but just have to deal with them... Unless you're an unfortunate neighbor... 2. No one is requesting absolute silence. I don't care about the fact that I can hear my neighbors' music from time to time, hear them cooking, or hear them walking around. However, a loud, persistant, distressing noise (aren't babies' cries evolutionarily supposed to get your attention or something?) in the middle of the night is ridiculous. What you're saying is pretty much equivalent to "Oh, you don't like strangers stabbing you with butter knives? Well, some people have butter knives and can't control their urges to poke random people with them. Either get used to it or live alone and away from society then, you selfish prick." Really??

So in your first scenario, saying "Oh no, my baby is crying! Time to put it up for adoption" is better? And when you live in an apartment you either accept the neighbours you have, or talk to your landlord to work something out. They're weren't purposefully trying to distress you. Or...in words you'll understand, "I don't like that this person who has no control is stabbing me with a butter knife. Maybe if I stand still and yell loudly at it it will stop."

No, my logic is "Hmmm. I really don't like things that constantly scream. Maybe being a parent isn't a good idea." Because obviously someone who doesn't want to take care of or deal with a baby shouldn't have to. If it was the middle of the night, the OP probably wasn't concerned with getting up and getting the landlord (which would probably cause him/her to lose even more sleep) and just did whatever seemed logical in his/her half asleep state. But you have to admit that if someone were stabbing you with a butter knife, your first reaction would be to yell at them to stop. At least now the parents know that their neighbors can hear their infant and it's bothering them, and they might consider taking it outside or something next time.

jersabelle88, you're assuming that everyone wants and will have kids. Don't.

You're assuming that one person, whom you know nothing about, wants a kid. Because you know nothing about her, she could be anyone. So you basically ARE assuming that everyone wants a kid, and even if you didn't mean to assume that everyone wants a kid, you're still wrong for assuming that this particular person (who, again, you don't know) wants a kid.

#79-- You mean when s/he gets cranky in response to something that was the parents' fault in the first place? They kind of deserve it.

No sweet heart they don't deserve it. It's a life no a consequence. You don't get punished for having children. Do you get punished for going to school? No you get something out of it. You really need to stop assuming you know everything. Because you dont. The world isn't about fault it's about living. Stop blaming parents, because someone can easily say its your parents fault you were raised to be an arrogant ass who thinks she knows everything, but they haven't. Your 15 you don't know jack about parenting or life really. You cant make sound proof walls without money, and without consent writer it may be with home items or real sound proof walls. You are making an ass out of your self. You are connecting and assuming things that just don't make sense. And your getting nowhere. You need to stop, you don't know child and how they work. You think you do. But your not as smart as you think. Why don't you babysit to get an idea of parenting?

In response to #17, yes, when I have kids I will probably yell when they wake me up. Maybe not at them, but I'll probably let off some steam, maybe call them the spawn of satan myself. Will it help, no. Will it make me feel a wee bit better, yes. All in good fun.

#163-- If the parents don't want to hear screaming, they don't have to have kids. It's as simple as that. Stop trying to overcomplicate it with feelings and life lessons. I only said that it's the parent's fault because, technically, having given birth to the baby, they have no right to complain about the crying.

Babies are PEOPLE, Sax. Little people who lack neurological control and have no language to express themselves. They are not "choices" or "responsibilities" or "fault"s. It's very hard to be trapped in a tiny body you have no control over, feeling distressing sensations with 0 ability to make them stop. I think this is the main point you're missing. Making more demands on the poor stressed parents could drive them to snap and maybe hurt the child - or themselves. Really! Don't do that, please! Raising a kid is serious business & it really does take a village. Maybe consider yourself an honorary auntie and offer to rock the baby some night? It's easy and self satisfying to blame the parents, but Honey, reproduction is an often uncontrollable drive refined by millions of years of evolution. And yes, it hits people at different ages. The fact that you are so anti-child at 15 is probably because of the evolutionary advantage of being a more mature parent. Not really a "decision" - tho it does feel like one- anymore than some peoples "decision" to have sex, or "decision" to have a baby.

I only commented because I saw *******.

Hip, Hip Hop, Hip Hop anonymous?

Good for you champ! That's what people do when they see your dick.